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Take a deep breath, count to ten...

...and post a picture of Brittany Snow.


mmmmm...Snooooowww.....what was all the fuss about again?

To our readers. I would like to apologize for my post on Friday. In the heat of the moment I responded to one vulgar, hate filled missive with another vulgar, hate filled missive, and as many have pointed out we should do better than that. We constantly try to keep things reasonably civil around here and encourage you all to make your comments and diaries respectful and not engage in the kind of flame war, pissing match posts that have turned so many of us off to message boards, and we (and especially in this case, I) have a duty to you to hold ourselves to that same standard. So to y'all, I am truly sorry for my language and tone. There was a better way to respond, but I took the easy way that gave me the most momentary satisfaction, and I do regret it.

I will be clear on this, though; this post is not meant in any way, shape, or form as an apology or act of contrition towards Brian Cook or any of his sanctimonious yes men that jumped on board the "let's take a break from trying to defend the questionable moral fiber of our own coach and bash Nick Saban for something we think he might do but have no proof that he has or will" bandwagon. I maintain that both of his posts were ignorant and ill informed, and that despite his constant whining about "the children, oh Lord, the children!" his motives for starting all of this were as pure as the driven Michigan snow (which is to say filthy and polluted). I will also be clear on this; this whole kerfluffle is by no means an SEC vs Big Ten thing, or even an Alabama vs Michigan thing. This is strictly a Roll Bama Roll vs Brian Cook thing.

Since this will be the last time we comment on this issue until the "checkbook is balanced," so to speak, at which point we will certainly keep you all up to speed on how the coaching staff managed to juggle the roster to see if any of the sinister accusations thrown our way had any merit, I would like to take the time to spell out, once and for all, our position in this matter.

1. Cook's initial post was nothing more than an ill informed shot taken for no reason at Nick Saban.

What seems to have been lost in all of the numbers games and denigration of the intellectual abilities of the good people of Alabama is that all of this started with Joe Tiller's comments about Rich Rodriguez:

"If we had an early signing date, you wouldn't have another outfit with a guy in a wizard hat selling snake oil get a guy at the last minute, but that's what happened," Tiller said.

Those comments were made after Roy Roundtree, a recruit who had committed to Purdue before receiving an offer from Rod and Michigan, decided he'd rather wear the Maize and Blue. And Cook was right to call out Tiller for his comments towards Rod and subsequent questioning of Roundtree's character:

Evocative imagery from the Big Ten's most crotchety coach, but Tiller wants to take away Roy Roundtree's ability to make a decision he wants to make. If Roundtree wanted to play for Purdue, he would.

Way to publicly knock the character of a guy who got an offer from Michigan he did not expect and decided to take it.

He's exactly right there. Tiller had no call to slam Rodriguez or Roundtree for this. Rod extended an offer after Purdue did, Roundtree accepted it, end of story, and that should have been the end of Cook's beef. He had adequately defended his coach and team against the foolish comments of a conference rival's coach. But he didn't stop there, did he? Of course he didn't. Instead, Cook felt the need to take the occasion of foolish and unwarranted comments made by Tiller to make some foolish and unwarranted comments of his own by claiming "Nick Saban's the Real Snake Oil Salesman Around These Parts." What did Nick Saban have to do with any of this? Nothing. Not a single thing (and I also found it amusing that he threw in the "Around These Parts" considering Nick Saban no longer coaches in the Big 10). And that is the beginning of where we (and the rest of the Alabama bloggers that have commented on this) take exception to Cook's singling out of Nick Saban and Alabama for a practice that is widely practiced throughout college football.

But that's not the only reason. To begin with, Cook decides to take aim at Alabama's recruiting class being ranked #1 in the country and stating that they are overrated based on sheer quantity. Pete Holiday has done a masterful job already of breaking down why that's simply ridiculous, so I'll let his argument speak for itself. But Cook also had some nastier implications to hurl Saban's way, all in the name of defending Rodriguez:

Around six guys who are playing for Alabama now or expect to be in the fall are going to be told to get bent by the time fall practice rolls around. But let's all complain about how nasty Rich Rodriguez is, why don't we?

Again, Saban had nothing to do with anything that transpired in the recruiting of Roy Roundtree or with Tiller's comments concerning Rod's role in it. That simple fact alone was enough to cause us to feel it necessary to respond, but it's the implication that Cook knows exactly what is going to happen at Alabama (and that what is going to happen at Alabama is sinister and damaging to the lives of both this recruiting class and the current roster) that really raised our ire. The fact is, no one knows but Saban and the coaching staff how the numbers are going to work and that, shockingly, doesn't include Cook.

Our biggest issue is his claims that deserving kids are going to be screwed over in all of this. Cook wants you to believe that some deserving kid that has kept his nose clean, bought wholeheartedly into the staff's philosophy, and done everything asked of him is going to get the axe in favor of some stud recruit. Do I think this is the case? No, I do not. Before last season and all during it there were warnings from Saban that the roster's talent level was nowhere near what it needed to be for a championship caliber team and that there were character issues all across the board. We saw stars from previous seasons sitting on the bench because they didn't do what their coaches asked of them while guys that wouldn't have seen the field at other top programs were getting quality playing time. If there is one thing I took away from this season concerning Saban's roster moves it's that he values loyalty and heart from his players and is going to put the guys on the field that do what they are asked and taught and have given complete and total commitment to the team and the staff over the guys who don't no matter how wide the talent gap is between them. So for Cook to insinuate that Saban is so cold hearted as to tell a deserving kid to "get bent" that's done everything asked of him, well, that's just not something I see happening. Of course, I can make that kind of assertion because I'm not a Michigan blogger with absolutely no knowledge of what I'm talking about trying to deflect attention from my coach, I'm an Alabama blogger that pays far more attention to what's going on with the Crimson Tide than I probably should. Cook had no reason to cast blanket proclamations about the "filthiness" of what is going on in Tuscaloosa when he doesn't cover Alabama football and therefor hasn't the slightest clue of the details necessary to make those claims, nor does he have any proof that these things are going to happen beyond a gut feeling based on nothing else but his apparently low opinion of Saban. I mean, I could claim that Cook is going to go on a mad gopher raping spree (to quote Cook, "Jesus, that's filthy.") based purely on my opinion of him, but that wouldn't make it true, and it's not something I would do unless someone actually gave me some sort of evidence that he does, in fact, have a sinister plan to acquire gophers and then have his awful way with them.


I cannot WAIT to see what kind of sick Google searches "gopher raping" brings in.

2. Cook's response to OTS's rebuttal devolved into the kind of condescending assault on the intellectual and moral worth of an entire state that we should have expected from him, all while being logically bankrupt itself.

Let's just start with the title "Alabama Fans Cannot Think Logically, But You Knew That Already." Right away Cook reminds us that he's a smarmy, holier than thou type that cackled with glee over the ludicrous "Saban to West Virginia" rumors and carries a gigantic chip on his shoulder concerning the fact that not only did the Confederate states continue to exist after the Civl War but also had the unmitigated gall to rebuild and start playing some pretty good football. His bile, of course, isn't completely reserved for the SEC or the South though, as anyone else that remembers his hysterical outrage at a post on Rodriguez meant purely in jest (and that he actually suspected was meant to be humorous but still went on the warpath over anyway) written by fellow Big Ten (Iowa) bloggers will attest. Cook is apparently a small, bitter man that patrols the internets day and night (don't forget folks, he actually gets paid to blog, which probably means he should get the same respect, by which I mean none, we generally reserve for the ignorant, blathering heads in the mainstream sports media that so routinely draw the malice of the blogosphere) not only making sure no one speaks ill of his beloved Wolverines and their coaching staff, but also making sure everyone knows that anything below the Mason-Dixon line is worthy of nothing but your contempt. So to say that I was shocked, shocked, by his attitude towards us or any of the other Alabama bloggers that had the nerve to call shenanigans on his ridiculous initial post would be a lie. It was expected, and he delivered.

And how did he deliver? With a well-worn debating trick: changing the subject. OTS's response was a fine refutation of each of Cook's claims, namely that the class is overrated, Saban is the worst offender, the number of guys who are not going to qualify, the use of medical redshirts on "marginally useful" players, and that six scholarships need to be forcibly extracted from current players. So what does Cook do? He posits an undeniable fact (that there are too many kids to fit on the 85 man roster, and room must be made to accomodate the incoming recruits) and then uses that as the basis of a purely speculative and hypothetical debate. In his eyes, if you can't deny that room must be made to reach the 85 man limit then you can't deny anything else he has to say. No one is denying that there is an 85 man roster limit, that Alabama is currently above it, and steps must be taken to correct that. As before, plenty of time has been spent on showing how this can be managed, but it's the implication that Cook knows in advance Saban is going to resort to "screwing" a deserving someone out of their scholarship is where we take exception. We can argue over who is deserving and who isn't, but the point is that none of us know what is going to happen until August, and that Cook simply isn't qualified to judge what is going on in Tuscaloosa. Just because you can look up a roster and work a calculator doesn't mean you should start chiming in on the ethics involved in a program you know nothing about. Are you really so vain that you feel like you can state as fact that Saban and the rest of the staff signed as many players as they did knowing full well that they would have to resort to nefarious methods to make room for them? Do you really think that Saban and the staff aren't fully aware of how many players are expected to transfer after the spring because they don't fit in the program anymore and will be encouraged to seek playing time elsewhere and helped in that process (like QB Jimmy Barnes, OL Alex Stadler, LB Zach Schreiber, and RB Jamar Taylor did last year)? Are you so certain that this staff is too dumb to know how a greyshirt works, and to have numbers on which signees were offered and accepted greyshirts? Are you so well versed in the culture of Alabama football and so intimately knowledgable about the character of each player and the efforts they've given over the past year that you can, without a doubt, believe that anyone the coaches decide shouldn't get a renewal is someone that deserves to have his scholarship renewed? No, you don't, so how dare you sit on your high horse and claim that the potential for unfair dealings is, in and of itself, something to be ashamed of, whether it actually occurs or not. That's an extremely ridiculous position to take (after all, there is the potential for me to kick someone's teeth out because I don't like the shirt they are wearing, but you can't arrest me for assault until I actually do it), and one that shouldn't have been taken at all.

So let that be the end of this until August when we can actually review what happened instead of foolishly presupposing the sins of Nick Saban and Alabama.

0 recs  |  Comment 16 comments

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concerns in the aftermath
i will repeat my initial observation that, by pulling what has been considered the best recruiting class saban actually is a valid target in the context of this issue. but, the key element is, in the context of this issue.

discussing the wrongs - perceived or not - of saban and his efforts to pull in recruits is simply a means of addressing a much wider practice which different schoold participate in to varying degrees.

where everything seems to have gone awry is when it turned into cheap shots and explitives aimed at saban, said blogs, haircuts and god knows what else. i quit reading pretty early on, actually.

the practice of signing more recruits than you can have on the roster is a complicated one that many of us would like to discuss to better understand as well as to express our reservations about. that's difficult to do when you are wading through a field of f-bombs.

i would appreciate it greatly if rbr could keep tabs on this issue from now on and let us know how well the recruiting class is retained. or, even better, if someone has the time and resources, go back and look at this issue in light of the past several years.

by kleph on Feb 18, 2008 8:37 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

I actually meant...
...to reference the fact that you had legitimate concerns about oversigning that got lost in all the mudslinging but forgot, so I'm glad you commented on it again. Oversigning does, indeed, have the potential for harm, but in this case and in most cases it works out pretty well for everyone involved. If it was truly as disgusting of a practice as it's being made out to be, I'd wager that either the NCAA or the conferences involved would take steps to keep oversigning in check, but so far there just haven't been that many cases of oversigning gone bad. For the most part, coaches (except for Bobby Petrino, anyway) sign kids with every intention of seeing them play whether they have a good chance to qualify or not. Plenty of them get shuffled off to JUCOs or prep schools, but they still have a scholarship waiting for them if and when they get their grades up and can enroll. Kerry Murphy is a perfect example from this class. He signed last year, didn't have the grades, spent a year at Hargrave, and is back. It would have been easy for Saban to say "sorry, we've got too many kids now, you should have had better grades last year" and left him hanging, but he didn't. And in our case especially, I'm pretty sure Saban and staff had a good idea of how to make the numbers work before handing out so many offers. I can't say that for a fact since I'm not on staff, but it really doesn't make sense that they would oversign to such a degree that they would be forced to take a scholarship away from someone that deserves it for the sole purpose of making room for a new recruit. And don't worry, we will be keeping a close eye on how the numbers are crunched and post them here.

by Todd on Feb 18, 2008 9:01 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Nice work Todd....
If it's alright, I'll let your post stand as TSIB's final word on the matter also. You've said it better that I could.

I just wonder if Cook knew that Bama twice denied the commitment of one of the best o-linemen in the Southeast (McClain). If Saban was as slimy as Cook claims, what's one more player told to "get bent"?

by YourCrimsonDaddy on Feb 18, 2008 9:12 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Food for thought for mr. Cook
If Saban was ok with booting kids off the team in order to make room for stud recruits why did he stop at 32?  Why not sign 50 recruits?

by t towngradstudent on Feb 18, 2008 9:20 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Apparently
This brian kid is somewhat known for his blog fights. He admittedly had my blood boiling just like everyone else, so he accomplished what he intended - hits on his aol site, hits on his primary blog site, etc.

on a side note, this photo of the snow looks remarkably like an ex girlfriend of mine. thinking i should give her a call, see if she's still married, etc

ROLL TIDE

by crbama on Feb 18, 2008 10:11 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

How did you...
...let that get away?

by Todd on Feb 18, 2008 11:39 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

well
have a few hours?

by crbama on Feb 18, 2008 11:51 AM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Jeremy Elder
I just saw this on Ian's and 3rd Saturday blogs.  

http://blog.al.com/rapsheet/2008/02/ua_freshman_tackle_jeremy_elde.html

by kennybk483 on Feb 18, 2008 10:45 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Regarding vulgar, hate filled missives
No worries.  I'm an adult and can handle adult language and adult situations.  Especially if a midget is involved.

by aladambama on Feb 18, 2008 10:46 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Thank you
Todd, I have a lot of respect for you to apologize to the readers for Friday's post. I was waiting for it and was sure you would come through.  I agree you have nothing to apologize for in regards to responding to the purposely inflammatory blogs of Brian Cook or his ignorant supporters.  You're our guys and we have your back.

by bamavicki on Feb 18, 2008 11:45 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Great post
Thanks Todd.

Although I do kind of wish you hadn't stooped to that pathetic malingerer's level. Picking fights is how little tiny men like Brian Cook validate their sad existences, but it is understandable.

by Cam on Feb 18, 2008 4:26 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

No one will be hurt
Good job Todd and I honestly believe not one kid will be kicked off the team. First of all if that actually happened the papers would have afield day. I do suspect some will transfer and for those kids it could be the best thing. I also suspect some will get in trouble with the law..as in today..or academically. Hate to be that way, but this is the way it works.

I seriously doubt that Saban will be glad when these things happen. I also know he will not make them happen as in force a kid to break the law. He may encourage a kid to transfer and might even call a Div II coach to help with a scholarship.

Still, I think if a kid desires to stay, knowing he will not get to play, and is willing to be a part of the program even when it looks like he will never play Saban will be glad for him to stay. I think this is what is going to happen with Greg McElroy, and I think Saban will not push him off the team even though he will likely not get any serious playing time. Greg appears to want to be on this team and Saban will allow him to stay and contribute in whatever way he can. Worse case senario is that a player or two is grey shirted and I'm sure a few of these new guys were told that when they signed.

Come on Saban has been at this a while and I have not heard any former players anywhere talking to the media about getting the boot.                    

by 5026 on Feb 18, 2008 8:05 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Unfortunately,
Brian made a post 3 hours after this one.  His rhetoric is much less pointed this time around, and slightly apologetic.  

I must also point out the ample amount of sarcasm that I feel is in this post.  Brian never attacks the State of Alabama or the intellect within its borders.

Lord knows this blog isn't above calling someone "horseface." A well-executed ad hominem is funny.  

The posts on his own website are there for Michigan fans, the same reason Todd does similar at Michigan.  You relate to them and find them funny.  

Pinning this on Brian due to his comments on the Tiller tirade is ridiculous.  

You might be able to make a case that Saban has even less time for NCAA regulations, ethics, and the like than most coaches if you were really trying hard or an Auburn fan. Personally, I don't care and believe that even if Saban is the winner it's by a nose over everyone except Jim Grobe. I only wrote the thing on Saban because of the Gayle article that drew a picture of severe oversigning even when you take most of the reasonable departures into account. This is a general hobby-horse of mine.

I don't see the point of including any more of his article.  It would basically be copying and pasting about half of it.  The other half is kerfuffle.  I'll let you read it yourself.  No one at Michigan really cares, as is noted in the first line of the post.  They have had more posts today about the over-hyping of NCAA basketball and the little league world series than anything to do with Alabama.

http://mgoblog.blogspot.com/2008/02/final-word-on-oversigning-and-alabama.html

by formerlyanonymous on Feb 18, 2008 8:39 PM CST reply actions   0 recs

Huh?
Did I completely misread your post or are you really trying to defend that guy?

Do you understand that he started it all with his unsolicited, purposefully misinformed, pathetic attack on Alabama participating in a practice that every school in the country has had it's hand in at one time or another? His position is completely indefensible, so don't even try to pretend with us as you seem to be doing with yourself.

by Cam on Feb 18, 2008 11:12 PM CST up reply actions   0 recs

Couldn't Focus
after that great shot of our new sweetheart Ms. Snow...  I was cruising through the post without understanding a word.  

Of course, maybe this will help in getting the flaming to calm down.  Music to the eyes soothes the savage beasts...

If you're not having fun, you're not doing it right.

by izntitgr8 on Feb 19, 2008 8:37 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

Found this today
Tide fans are apparently unfamiliar with the use of these devices.

I always feel a little sheepish when I learn about important articles in the Alabama media from bloggers in various far-flung parts of the country--finding said articles being one of the things I do, theoretically--but anyways, a big thumbs up to MGo/Fanhouse's Brian for bringing attention to this eye-opening article by Tim Gayle at the Advertiser.

Gayle breaks out the calculator on Alabama's roster-plus-signing class and finds out, whoops, even after non-qualifiers and medical departures Bama's still going to have promised 85 scholarships to somewhere in the neighborhood of 91 players come August. So unless six guys have a fantastic conversation with a representative from their local congregation of Latter-Day Saints and take off for a two-year mission in Estonia, Saban's going to have to, well, tell six guys they're now responsible for their own $12,000 a year if they would like to continue receiving a college education from the University of Alabama. Given that any player Saban chooses to cut is likely to also be the sort of player he can't find a use for on the field (given that if you are useful, he will find a way to get you on the field, by golly), those scholarships and the education attached possibly carry even greater importance to the players in question than most of the team. Oh well! Enjoy filling out your loan applications, kiddos. Or, I guess, enjoy I-AA or a year on Florida International's bench.

Brian's obviously not a fan of oversigning, but it's the heartlessness of Saban potentially stripping kids of their scholarships that's his essential point--a point completely lost on the Alabama bloggers who have responded to it. One of them is the Fanhouse's resident Tide supporter and thrower of stones in glass houses Pete Holiday, who blithely asserts that "academic disqualification, medical problems, early entries, team dismissals for rules violations" should solve Alabama's numbers issues (nevermind that draft entries for the year in question are long since past or that assuming six guys have horrific injuries or break rules really does make an ass out of U and me) while completely ignoring the whole, you know, guys getting their scholarship jacked thing. Even after a commenter helpfully reminds Holiday of the potential for cuts, Holiday reverts back to a no-more-than-25-in-a-class mantra, which is certainly true and all, but doesn't change the fact that Alabama has, according to Gayle, "70 non-seniors" on the roster and that 70 + 25 does not, in fact, equal 85. (In that comment Holiday also says "Spring enrollments are the only ones you need cap room for, and I don't think Alabama is anticipating having any of those" ... despite the fact that Gayle said two Tide signees had enrolled in January. Did he even read the article in question?)

But at least Holiday sort of recognizes that qualifying more than 25 players might be tricky. Meanwhile, at RollBamaRoll, OTS tells Brian, in response to his guesses at how many Tide signees won't qualify, that "you can eat those words six months from now when nearly all of this class has academically qualified." Again, back to Gayle:

The signing class will probably include several players who will not meet the minimum SEC academic requirements to earn admission to Alabama. That group includes Davidson tailback Jermaine Preyear, Mississippi cornerback Alonzo Lawrence, Huffman defensive lineman Marcel Dareus, Hargrave lineman Kerry Murphy and possibly receivers Melvin Ray and Devonta Bolton. If the remaining 24 players all qualify and at least two of those previously mentioned make the grade, Alabama coaches will have to delay someone's enrollment until 2009 or bring in a player as a walk-on, as former coach Mike DuBose's staff did with Terry Jones Jr. in the late 1990s.

Kid, we really, really need you to come play for the University of Alabama. You'll sign with us? Great! And hey, you studied all summer and got that ACT score you needed. Awesome! Welcome aboard! Oh, but we forgot to mention, you'll have to be a walk-on and that free tuition we promised you ... yeah, you're not getting that this year. Hope your parents have some dough stashed away. Or you can not play football for a year, that sounds cool, right? Not playing?

Apparently, either OTS is unaware of the 25-a-year cap (which I seriously, seriously doubt) or this scenario doesn't bother him. Promises, schmomises. We don't really know, since he skips the ramifications of all 29 guys qualifying to repeatedly make fun of Brian's hair (Stay classy, buddy).

OTS does, at the least, acknowledge that players are going to have to leave the team. "Players are going to leave and we all know it," he writes. "Many of the former staffs' previous signees, particularly on the defensive side of the ball, do not fit with the current scheme and may very well end up going elsewhere." Well, see, here's the rub--are they going to leave because they really feel they fit in better elsewhere, or are they leaving because they've been told, as Brian put it, to "get bent"? "No one is being 'run off' or anything sinister of the sort," OTS asserts, but for the Alabama coaching staff to simply--here comes that word again--assume that their kids are going to bail is ethically dubious to the Nth degree. What if they don't? What if they collectively decide that hey, this new signing class looks pretty sweet, I'm going to tough it out and play for a winner? What happens then is that kids have their scholarships taken away for not playing the game of football well enough to satisfy Nick Saban.

"Attrition is simply a part of college football," OTS writes. Good riddance," he said to potential "attrition" in December. Now, the kind of attrition where kids gets fed up and leave or get hurt or don't qualify, that attrition I can deal with. But the breaking of a $12-K-plus promise to a kid because the coaches don't think he's useful ... that kind I can't. I've said so before on this blog, and I remain fidgety about Auburn's oversigning for this very reason (Our side has had so many non-qualifiers this doesn't appear to be a problem, hooray hooray). Attrition of that sort should never, ever be a part of college football.

It must be pointed out that this attrition hasn't happened yet. I expect 'Bama to get their signing class down to 25 without forcing anyone to enroll as a walk-on. I'm sure a couple of players will decide on their own between now and August that Bama isn't the place for them. Add a couple to that category, suffer some fortunate debilitating injuries, and maybe Saban doesn't have to make cuts after all.

But that he would ever put his program in the position of hoping he's able to run kids off or that they get injured ... well, this is your soulless Coachbot at work, ladies and gents.

Disclaimer: RBR remains, of course, the go-to blog for the Tide, whatever I thought of OTS's post discussed here. Todd and Nico do great work and OTS is a sharp analyst when discussing, uh, less Saban-related matters--as, ironically, even Brian has pointed out.

UPDATE: Cripes. Perhaps before posting I should make sure in the future that nothing developed on the Auburn newswire late the previous evening that might make me look like a giant hypocrite. For the record: if Tubby pushed these guys out rather than having them simply decide to leave--one of them according to Marshall is about to graduate already, so at least he won't need the scholly in the fall--it's just not defensible. Likewise, the attitude of some Auburn fans in the comments that it's a good thing for Tubby to "rid the team of weight that is not performing" is, well, nauseating. I wish Daniels, Shrader, Miller, and Ferguson the best and really, really, really hope this is a decision they genuinely wanted to make, a decision that hopefully won't hurt an education they actually want. I'm not confident that's the case.

by bammer on Feb 20, 2008 9:52 AM CST reply actions   0 recs

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