University of Mississippi football fans who refuse to stop chanting "the South will rise again" are...

University of Mississippi football fans who refuse to stop chanting "the South will rise again" are on the verge of losing one of their favorite fight songs, the school's chancellor said Monday.

Ole Miss Chancellor Dan Jones said "From Dixie With Love" will no longer be played at games if fans continue the racially offensive chant.

AP: Ole Miss will lose fight song if fans chant 'the South will rise again,' says chancellor

I saw this earlier and found it to be interesting. Obviously this is a very controversial subject that is pretty hotly debated by Ole Miss supporters, casual football fans, and politicos in general.

Say what you will about freedom of speech and political correctness, but it seems to me that this is really all about Ole Miss trying to improve its image to help recruit black athletes. Even if that's the sole reason for the move, that's no crime to be sure. It's no great secret that big-time modern day college football is, by and large, a black man's game. Black men constitute the great majority of all players, and they seem to be even more prevalent when talking about elite players. For example, 20 of the 21 current Rivals.com five-star recruits are black, and 30 of the 33 five-stars from the 2009 class were black. So Ole Miss wants to do things to help itself in that regard to improve the overall competitiveness of the program, fair enough.

On the other hand, though, it's not like recruits -- whether they be black, white, hispanic, or whatever else -- are exactly kicking down the door to play at Ole Miss anyway, and there are plenty of good reasons for that. They haven't really won anything in decades, their stadium is one of the smallest in the conference, the facilities are second-rate, they generally don't get a lot of national attention, and there isn't exactly a pipeline running from Oxford to the NFL. I guess that's what I don't get about this. These changes may be good, but realistically this is at absolute most just a single drop in an ocean. I don't care what the fight song does say or doesn't say, there are still a million reasons why high-end recruits wouldn't want to go to Ole Miss. If you want to change it for whatever other reason, then fine, but if you're wanting to change it for this reason, it seems pretty dumb.

over 2 years ago outsidethesidelines 11 comments 0 recs |

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maybe they are changing it because

it reeks of ignorant racism, and ceasing to use the chant is the right thing to do?

welcome to the SEC kiffykins...

by tempebamafan on Nov 4, 2009 3:22 AM CST reply actions

I didn't realize

Ole Miss had trouble recruiting black athletes.

And to say that the phrase ‘the South will rise again’ “reeks of ignorant racism” is a typical knee-jerk, over-the-top PC reaction. But then again, I forgot how well blacks and whites were getting along in this country, working together arm in arm with no regard to skin color until the South came along and ruined it for all eternity.

by yellowhammer on Nov 4, 2009 9:37 AM CST reply actions 1 recs

you can try to justify it however you want

but anyone with an understanding of the history of american slavery and of the jim crowe era, understands that the south “rising again” is a not too thinly veiled reference to the plantation/slavery/jim crowe era. my whole family is from the south, and i’m as proud as can be of my family’s heritage, that said, having the “stars n bars” flying, or talking about how the south shall rise again is just stupid fucking pointless revisionism at best, outright racism and delusional psychosis at worst.

seriously, whats the legacy ol miss students are referring too then? if not lynchings, segregation, rape, and brutality? would it be the 110 year period of apartheid that followed the civil war? or are they talking about Faulkner. i could be wrong, maybe they’re referencing Faulkner afteral….(i highly fucking doubt it)

welcome to the SEC kiffykins...

by tempebamafan on Nov 4, 2009 11:06 AM CST up reply actions

I'd get rid of it myself...

Just as a personal opinion, I see no need for any chant like that, particularly at an institution with the history of Ole Miss in terms of racial equality. Any time your campus needed 20,000+ soldiers for almost one year just so one black student could enroll, well, 40 years after the fact, you probably should be cautious about phrases that can be racially charged.

And I’m actually a big proponent of free speech and someone who thinks 99.999% of political correctness is total garbage. In this case, though, I see this one is entirely reasonable. Given the South’s poor history with regard to race — especially for Ole Miss in particular — you don’t have to be some nutjob to find mass recitations of phrases like, “The South Will Rise Again” as being highly offensive. You can very reasonably come to that conclusion.

Again, though, I find a hard time seeing where this is really all that worthwhile, though. There are a lot of things you could find with a place like Ole Miss that would be considered highly offensive, and they aren’t doing jack shit to fix any of those things. And do you think it’s a coincidence that they are specifically calling out the song at football games? There is a reason for that.

I don’t think Ole Miss really gives two shits about making any major changes, nor do I think they are really being PC Nazis over this one either. They’re just trying to help out of the football program, nothing more.

"Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself." -- Milton Friedman

by outsidethesidelines on Nov 4, 2009 3:44 PM CST up reply actions

Not trying to justify..

In fact, I agree that the chant should stop because it ruins the song and comes off as childish and rude. My point is that the phrase itself is not racist, but is assumed to be because any expression of Southern pride or defiance is automatically classified as such.

I do have an understanding of the history of Amercan slavery to know that Africans were brought to this continent against their will to be sold like livestock long before there was a ‘south’ or ‘confederacy’ and was tolerated for decades in the USA. It was just as inexcusable in the 1700’s as it was in the 1800’s.

There is plenty of blame to go around from the English government to the American colonists to the founding fathers and so on, but the rest of the nation exclusively blames the South for slavery on this continent and Southerners to this day are scapegoats for all of the racial problems in U.S. history.

by yellowhammer on Nov 5, 2009 9:17 AM CST up reply actions

Eh...

Well, I’m not really sure the phrase is “racist,” per se, either. It all depends on the context in which it is used, and in this case I’m not sure that it is. Obviously the phrase can be racist — it’s not a favorite of the Klan for nothing — but when people are somewhat mindlessly saying it like they are here, I don’t think that is necessarily the case.

With that said, however, I do think something can be reasonably interpreted as being racially offensive, even if it is not outright racism. I do believe there is legitimate distinction to be made between the two. And with that in mind, I do think this phrase can reasonably be interpreted as racially offensive.

And my issue with your post, really, is that’s it’s not just about slavery. That is a part of it (and the fact that the CSA literally fought and died in an attempt to protect the institution certainly means something) and it’s a good sized part of it, but there is just so much more. It’s less about slavery — which, far from what many would like to believe as something being isolated to the American South, is actually something that has been practiced in almost every single major society since the dawn of time, and is something that still exists today in many parts of the world — more than it is about post-1865 history in general. It’s Jim Crow, the KKK, Emmett Till, the Philadelphia Three, Medgar Evers, Ross Barnett, James Meredith needing 20,000 troops to go to class, etc.

And when an institution with that kind of history comes out waiving confederate flags, with a confederate colonel as their mascot, and 60,000 people chanting “The South Will Rise Again” every time the fight song is played, then I can see some people extremely pissed off about all of that, and not wanting to be involved in that institution.

"Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself." -- Milton Friedman

by outsidethesidelines on Nov 5, 2009 11:10 AM CST up reply actions

Yeah...

… and how many of those black athletes in that photo were worth a shit recruits coming out of high school? Ole Miss has never recruited well in basketball — and in fact has never even came close — so that just proves the point.

"Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself." -- Milton Friedman

by outsidethesidelines on Nov 4, 2009 3:48 PM CST up reply actions

"There are a lot of things you could find with a place like Ole Miss that would be considered highly offensive..."

"High standards come from passion within...." --Coach Nick Saban

by NiceLittleSaturday on Nov 5, 2009 9:28 AM CST reply actions

This is a tough one

but I honestly think the need to hang on to the ghosts of the Confederacy is a little silly. Please keep in mind that I’m not a liberal or Yankee boy or anything else. My mother’s family grew up in Virginia and they go a long way back, long before the Civil War. That said, I don’t think the Confederate flag and chants like this are relevant now, even at Ole Miss.

No one will deny that the men who fought in the Civil War displayed great bravery. But to hold on to that cause, whatever one claims that exact cause is (and I say this because I have relatives who will argue to the death that it wasn’t about slavery or hatred of America but State’s Rights, blah, blah, blah) is just crazy right now. The Civil War was not a good moment in American history. It’s not a good moment in Southern history. While I don’t think Southerners need to turn their backs on history in shame or deny their Mississippi birthright, I don’t think they need to hold onto something that has come, passed, and worn out its welcome.

The Civil War is a dark moment in our history. Americans killed Americans. The Southern states rebelled, which means chants like this echo that same rebellious mindset, which makes them seditious, unwelcoming, and offensive to people who are now, like it or not, included in society. We don’t have to love our elected officials and our government by any stretch to be good citizens, but justifying any sort of glorification of the confederacy now is ridiculous. We’ve had other wars since then. If it’s just about honoring history, sing about D-Day or Hill 368 (what was that shit about Vietnam, man? Why does everything have to be about Vietnam?) A lot has happened since then. The rebellion is over. We’ve made tremendous strides. Racially we’re pretty cool. Why hold onto something that divided the nation, hurt ~~Southerners and Northerners~~Americans, and offends people of color? They can argue it’s not offensive, but the people arguing are white. If black people say it’s offensive, how can they argue that it’s not?

MATRIX: Bennett, I thought you were--

BENNETT: Dead? You thought wrong. Ever since you had me thrown out of the unit, I've been waiting to pay you back. Do you know what today is, Matrix? Payday.

by Bamagrad on Nov 5, 2009 11:54 AM CST reply actions 2 recs