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But when you just watch the fourth quarter, it's impossible to blame this on one call. LSU went into the tank when the game mattered most. No first downs in the fourth quarter. The officials didn't do that, LSU's offense did. Julio Jones getting a long TD catch off a screen pass untouched, that wasn't the officials doing, that was the LSU defense.

Patrick Peterson's non-interception was a key play, but not nearly as big as LSU's failure to get two yards on 3rd and 2 up 15-13. If LSU converts there, maybe they can put together a drive, or at least give the defense a much needed breather. Instead, LSU punted and then Julio Jones made his big catch. With Peterson sitting on the bench, still trying to recover from injury.

And The Valley Shook - Well, That Sucked

ATVS with the most sensible thing you'll read about "The Call" this week.

over 2 years ago Disreputable_tiny Todd 25 comments 0 recs  | 

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This is a very mature response

I think like this also. As I stated in another post, make the play on the field. If the call doesn’t go your way, make it more convincing. Put the blame on yourself, in football and life. If something doesn’t go your way, if it’s questionable or just blown by the official, ask yourself what you could have done to erase all doubt.

If you’re playing defensive line and the quarterback throws a 70 yard touchdown, it’s your fault for not sacking the QB. If you’re playing defensive back and the quarterback has fifteen seconds to throw and he throws a 70 yard touchdown, it’s your fault for not covering the man better.

The call didn’t go LSU’s way. In past years some calls haven’t gone our way. So what. That’s bush league psyche out stuff, man. Laughable. Don’t be somebody who blames games on officiating.

1995 against Arkansas we lost in the fourth quarter and there was a very controversial penalty called on Alabama that extended an Arkansas drive. The thing is, we lost. We didn’t make the play to win the game. We didn’t do what we had to do on the next play.

MATRIX: Bennett, I thought you were--

BENNETT: Dead? You thought wrong. Ever since you had me thrown out of the unit, I've been waiting to pay you back. Do you know what today is, Matrix? Payday.

by Bamagrad on Nov 8, 2009 12:16 PM CST reply actions  

All I can say is...

1) The ball was kicked at the 4 yard line by an LSU defender, but it was placed on the goal line, which led to the safety.

2) Wasn’t it Smelley who had a similar catch to that the LSU defender “intercepted”, earlier in the game that was ruled incomplete?

3) A clip on one of their big drives that wasn’t called.

4) I couldn’t tell you how many times I saw their WR’s blatantly holding, yet they weren’t called for it.

5) And is it illegal to consistently trip Julio Jones up every opportunity Peterson (I believe) got?

PS: ROLL TIDE!!

by rhYno on Nov 8, 2009 12:25 PM CST reply actions  

1) The ball was kicked at the 4 yard line by an LSU defender, but it was placed on the goal line, which led to the safety.

I really wish people would just STFU about the safety. Listen: we fucked up. We had ample opportunities to keep from getting a safety, and we didn’t. It wasn’t the punt. It wasn’t the 3 yards that they gained. It was our poor offense and/or their good defense.

You simply cannot blame a safety on the punt and then say that the (potentially) missed INT call was no big deal.

I'm wrong all the time.

by PeteHoliday on Nov 8, 2009 10:09 PM CST up reply actions  

as noted elsewhere on this blog in postgame comments

one area of play that lsu clearly had the upper hand all day was defensive line play. they pretty much dominated our OL the whole game and this goalline situation was the perfect example. the placement of the ball within the five yard line is of little difference if we can’t protect our quarterback.

Roll 'Bama Roll: The Champagne of 'Bama Blogs.

by kleph on Nov 9, 2009 7:43 AM CST up reply actions  

On GMacs first pass attempt to the TE.........

I think it was Smelly or Williams. Anyway the point is the pass was called incomplete. I watched this play several times and it was a catch plain and simple. Both feet were in bounds and he had control of the ball. Only after hitting the ground and rolling over did the ball come out. Yes the ball came out but only after he was out of bounds and the play was over. Bama was robbed on this call. I’m wondering if the reason this play wasn’t overturned was because of the replay booth taking a power hit at the same time. Thus allowing the playcall on the field to stand. They simpley didn’t have a way to review it.

Your temper brings dishonor to my happy mooshu palace.

by mulletover on Nov 9, 2009 10:56 AM CST up reply actions  

So we got away with one.

Now we’re even after the LSU Alabama 2004 Pass Interference no-call

"A man's character may be learned from the adjectives which he habitually uses in conversation." - Mark Twain

by Stu from Tuscaloosa on Nov 8, 2009 12:26 PM CST reply actions  

We're not...

…even close to even for that horse-sh#t call….

"High standards come from passion within...." --Coach Nick Saban

by NiceLittleSaturday on Nov 8, 2009 8:15 PM CST up reply actions  

At least LSU got the benefit of a replay on the alleged INT. We had a completion that was ruled out-of-bounds early in the game that didn’t get the same benefit because the “replay booth was down”.

No-one cares about that, however. No-one cares about the BS placement of the ball on the 1-foot line in the 3rd quarter that directly led to a safety either. The ball was touched by an LSU player at the three yard line and should have been placed there.

Everyone can play the bad call game. It’s been my experience that the bad calls usually even out. The problem is that journalists, announcers and fans take certain bad calls and anoint them as “game-changing”. There’s no guarantee what calls will be game changing and which won’t. We can agree that if there is a bad call that directly allows or nullifies a scoring play in a tight game, that is likely a game-changing play. However, some of the bad calls that are swept under the rug could have been just as important to the outcome of the game. No-one knows because the course of the future was changed by the outcome of the call.

If the replay booth had been operable and that out-of-bounds call on that early pass had been overruled, we might have marched down the field and scored on the first drive. That could have disheartened LSU and a blowout might have been the result. The fact that the bad call was left to stand may have affected the confidence of our players and that could have explained our slow start (3 points in first half).

In the third quarter, if the ball had been placed correctly at the three yard line, our play calling might have been a bit different and the safety might not have occurred. Remember that we had just finished a dominating drive ending in a McElroy-to-Hanks TD pass. Without the safety and having some remaining momentum, we might have marched it down the field for another scoring drive which could have been enough to ensure the win at 17-7. As it was, LSU got the safety, the ball, a momentum boost and a touchdown, making the score 15-10. So, the incorrect ball placement was quite possibly the cause for a 15 point swing.

That’s game-changing, but no-one is bringing that missed call to light. Why? Because there was no charged replay timeout on it? Because it didn’t appear to be important at the time? Maybe it is because emotion instead of logic is driving these arguments. Emotional arguments are usually very shallow and they ignore the facts that require a bit more research and rational judgement.

After spending seven wondrous years in the state of Alabama, never in my life have I seen fans, who claim to be loyal to one team, spend more time AUbsessing over the other more so than they do their very own.

by SanFranDude12 on Nov 8, 2009 1:19 PM CST reply actions  

I disagree on a few points.

Yes the replay being down was unfortunate, but we still got that first down, so it really was a non-factor. If we hadn’t, sure it would’ve been significant, but there’s no point in thinking like that

On the ball placement, I doubt our playcalling changes on two yards. If Julio made that catch the safety doesn’t happen, and that was much more crucial than the two yards.

Basically I don’t agree that either of those calls would have changed the game. If Greg Mcelroy had gotten the ball to Julio when he was wide open in the endzone that could have changed the game, if Julio had caught that pass when we started on the inch line that could have changed the game, if Patrick Peterson had been in on the screen pass to Julio, if Jordan Jefferson had stayed in, if Charles Scott had stayed in those could have changed the game, not the officiating. If we had lost that game they’d be talking about those calls that you mentioned instead of the interception, and that’s how it will always be. Controversy sells news and brings in viewers, and neutral officiating does not (especially this year). I do agree that the officiating was relatively equal, and that your initial premise was a good one, but it seems a bit bitter when you finish by bashing the refs on calls that were non-factors, and when you win the game even with those calls.

"Behind every argument is someone's ignorance." - Louis Brandeis

by franchizeplaya on Nov 8, 2009 3:37 PM CST up reply actions  

On the ball placement, I doubt our playcalling changes on two yards.

You think we’d do a QB sneak on first down if the ball was on the 2-3 yard line instead?

by Nico2.0 on Nov 8, 2009 3:57 PM CST up reply actions  

Exactly...

…not needing to sneak to get a little breathing room gives us an extra down.

Roll Bama Roll - The Champagne of Bama Blogs.

by Todd on Nov 8, 2009 6:19 PM CST up reply actions  

Fair enough.

Point taken.

"Behind every argument is someone's ignorance." - Louis Brandeis

by franchizeplaya on Nov 8, 2009 7:12 PM CST up reply actions  

Extra breathing room that we got with the sneak. At that point there was only a one-down difference, and we had a receiver drop a wide-open pass and then a quarterback commit intentional grounding in the end-zone.

The safety is 100x more Julio’s fault than 2-3 yards on a punt.

I'm wrong all the time.

by PeteHoliday on Nov 8, 2009 10:11 PM CST up reply actions  

The punt itself isn't what's important here...

…what’s at issue is that there was a non-call that could be labeled “game changing” just as easily as the supposed INT. We don’t know what would have happened had the ball been placed on the four instead of the goal line, just like we don’t know what LSU would have managed had they gotten the INT. Had the ball been placed on the four, our play calling changes. Had they gotten the INT, the swing in momentum could have resulted in points for them. But since it’s all speculative, there’s no reason to talk about it. The only reason it’s being brought up is the fact that there were plenty of calls in this game that people could be taking issue with, but to focus on only one that supposedly gave the game to Alabama is stupid. There were just as many (if not more) bad calls that went LSU’s way, but since we won the alleged bad call is the one that’s going to be talked about all week until someone starts whining about a call next week and the media comes up with more SEC OFFICIAL CONSPIRACY evidence to harp on.

Roll Bama Roll - The Champagne of Bama Blogs.

by Todd on Nov 8, 2009 10:46 PM CST up reply actions   1 recs

observation...

i spoke to a few lsu fans after the game and heard a good number talking about the game. NONE mentioned officiating as their concern about the game. the controversy is exclusive to the emphasis it gets on television.

Roll 'Bama Roll: The Champagne of 'Bama Blogs.

by kleph on Nov 9, 2009 7:45 AM CST up reply actions  

I do think we call a running play (admittedly one that might have had more success), but I still think the pass to Julio happens on second down, and the safety on third would’ve happened regardless of the extra two yards, and probably even if we get three yards on the first down running play.

"Behind every argument is someone's ignorance." - Louis Brandeis

by franchizeplaya on Nov 8, 2009 4:04 PM CST reply actions  

Yes if Mark Ingram busted through the line on 1 and 10 from the 3 or 4 that eliminates the safety, but LSU didn’t just hand us huge gains on short yardage at any point in the game.

I do see though that the playcalling would have been different, I just don’t believe it would’ve changed the direction of the game.

"Behind every argument is someone's ignorance." - Louis Brandeis

by franchizeplaya on Nov 8, 2009 4:11 PM CST reply actions  

Thanks for the link

And calling me “sensible”. That’s a first. And I see that you guys have picked up on my “the 3rd and 2 play was the most important of the game” in the above post. Obviously, I agree. Even if LSU punts, it probably gives Peterson enough time to get back on the field because, as we saw, the Tide was able to exploit Peterson sitting on the bench.

I do want to make one point about “The Call” that has not been made. One of the things I hate about replay is the way it absolves the officials on the field. Two different media outlets posted photos of Peterson’s foot divot on their pages today. It’s not like the official on the field couldn’t look down and use that little piece of evidence to help with their call. But once it goes to the replay booth, we’re left to talking about “indisputable evidence”. So everyone gets into an argument about the replay guy. LSU fans shouldn’t be mad at the replay guy, we should be made at the ref who made the call in the first place.

I saw Indiana-Iowa. I know what egregiously biased officiating looks like. This was not it. The refs blew the call, but the far bigger factor was that LSU’s offense was virtually down to its B team in the fourth. I don’t have worlds of confidence that Lee and Ridley could have keyed the game winning drive even if Peterson makes the INT.

Fake Pundit. Real Fan.
http://www.andthevalleyshook.com

by Poseur on Nov 8, 2009 4:57 PM CST reply actions  

I know it's water under the bridge now but..

would you post the links of the foot-divot photos? Just curious. Thanks.

by yellowhammer on Nov 8, 2009 5:43 PM CST up reply actions  

No problem

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/andy_staples/11/07/lsu.alabama/index.html

The other was from the Advocate and I used the photo on the post already linked. It has the LSU players pointing at the divot. But you’re right, water under the bridge. Y’all won fair and square.

Fake Pundit. Real Fan.
http://www.andthevalleyshook.com

by Poseur on Nov 8, 2009 5:54 PM CST up reply actions  

Well, the divot...

….isn’t conclusive since I think the bigger issue is whether he had control of the ball in inbounds or not. I don’t think there is any doubt that the first foot came down inbounds (thus the divot), but at that point I don’t think he had control of the ball. The real question was did his second toe get down when he did have control of the ball, and that’s what’s up for debate. The replay never had a good angle on that (the bottom of his foot was cut off) so it was impossible to see if he was on the line or not, and the fact there weren’t two divots, one right after the other, suggests that he didn’t get it down. I think if the ruling on the field had been INT they wouldn’t have had enough evidence to overturn that either, so the replay official did the right thing. As for the guys on the field, yeah, y’all could probably gripe about that, just like we can gripe about some of the no calls that went against us (tapping the ball towards the EZ on the kick off that resulted in a safety, etc). The biggest problem everyone has is definitively saying such and such play is a “game changing” play and the fact that the media, ever hungry for a story, is driving the “poor SEC officiating” meme because its a more compelling story than just teams playing on the field and bad calls/no calls is just a part of the game.

Roll Bama Roll - The Champagne of Bama Blogs.

by Todd on Nov 8, 2009 6:30 PM CST up reply actions  

does anyone have a video with this almost inerception. I missed it

by cashvilletitans12 on Nov 8, 2009 6:00 PM CST reply actions  

seems th eonly ones that can be produced

show an incomplete pass as the defender’s foot is out of bounds. LSU fans, denis dodd, and pete holiday are furiously searching for the one that shows an INT though. i guess just check back later for an update?…

welcome to the SEC kiffykins...

by tempebamafan on Nov 9, 2009 10:33 AM CST up reply actions  

a slightly tangental observation about the play from someone who was at the game...

we were completely in the dark on what was going on. when the official went to make the call he was cut off mid sentence. we all had no idea what was being reviewed – an interception or incomplete pass. so we just kind of stood around waiting to hear what it was ruled AND what the replay decided the whole time.

gentry estes mentions this in his story today.

Roll 'Bama Roll: The Champagne of 'Bama Blogs.

by kleph on Nov 8, 2009 7:36 PM CST reply actions  

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