Why Overtime Needs To Be Abolished
To begin with I’ve got to be honest. Alabama stinks at overtime. It seems to me a-we panic and b- we have no plan whenever we go into overtime. However, that being said, overtime itself is a blight on college football.
To begin with overtime is not even football it is a sport invented to prevent tie games.
(1) Allowing each team to start with great field position is not football. In football you have to earn the 25 yard line.
(2) In football you have a game clock. The time left in the game dictates a situation. In overtime you have no game clock.
(3) In football you chose when you go for two or one, not the rules.
Secondly, overtime rewards the coin toss winner. I don’t know the exact stats but the winner of the toss wins the game more often. How is that fair? A tie game might as well be decided by a coin flip.
Third, overtime adversely effects the regular time. Basketball overtime is fine because it is an extension of the regulation. You never see a basketball team playing for overtime. Baseball’s extra innings do not effect the way you play the first nine. But in football with a tie game and 5 minutes to go teams start playing not to lose, rather than to win. I’d even go so far as to say that last night that dumb Honey Nut took out Dre because he was afraid Dre was about to separate his return man from the ball. A penalty, even a penalty for assault with intent to injure, is ok as long as we keep the tie in place.
Anyone watching last night could clearly see both teams go extremely conservative in play calling and time management just to get to overtime. It reminded me of Notre Dame running the clock our on Mich. St. in 1966. That, by the way was a terrible game. Two teams playing not to lose.
Fourth, overtime makes coaches make dumb decisions. Let me give you an example. If a team scores with no time left and needs a 1 pt. conversion to tie the score they almost always kick the 1 pt to go to overtime. Assuming each team’s odds in overtime are 50-50, this is a bad choice. Failure rate of a 1 point conversion is 2%. Combining those stats you see that a team lining up to kick a 1 pt. conversion has only a 49% chance of winning the game. However, the success rate of a 2 pt. conversion is 55%. So, going for 2 at the end of the game actually gives you a 6% better chance of getting the win than kicking the point. But, because we have been lulled into this overtime thing coaches make a dumb mistake and attempt to kick the point. (Let me point out the same thing applies to a team that scores 2nd in the first or second over time and kicks for
the tie to go to another overtime. It is the wrong decision.)
Fifth, football is not made to be an overtime game. Football is so physically hard 60 minutes is all it should be played IN A WEEK. Every other sport, baseball, basketball, soccer, etc. you can play everyday. You can not play football but once a week. Overtime is just too taxing. I’m always glad when overtime is over and no one on Bama's tram is hurt because I’m telling you it is a real possibility. And teams playing two or three overtimes or more will actually hurt their chances of recovering in time for the next game.
Sixth, football conferences etc. do not require clear cut winners in every game. The only time you need to have a clear winner is when you have a playoff and only 1 team can advance. Aside form that, a tie is just fine in the standings, the polls, etc.
Seventh, not all ties are bad and some games actually should end in a tie. Last night was a good example. The game should have ended in a tie with the last team with the ball still trying to score. I know Coach Bryant said a tie was like kissing your sister. But in his first 3 years at Bama he had 5 ties and everybody seemed pretty happy about the way the program was headed. By the way, he said it was like kissing your sister which I’m taking he meant giving your sister a hello kiss on the cheek which basically invokes no real emotion. He did not say it was like having a kidney stone.
Eighth, the overtime rule took the best drama situation in football and eliminated it. The best drama situation was when the favorite team scores near the end and has to decided to go for one for a tie or two for the win. That is like the Nebraska v. Miami for the NC. Nebraska would have won the NC with a tie, but went for the win and lost. We had a similar thing with USC in 1977.
Ninth, back on this train of thought that we must have a clear winner. Why do we think that? I live in Ga. Our high school football has a great approach to the play-offs. When playing an elimination game teams will play overtime. However, if the championship game ends regulation in a tie, both teams are declared co-champions. I’m good with that. Maybe, just maybe, there are some times when two teams are actually even, equal, etc. Why not let both be champions? I mean is that some kind of disgrace?
Tenth, overtime rewards luck. Now there was no luck involved last night other than the coin toss which sealed our fate But, a lot of overtime games are decided by pure luck. In the course of game the bounces usually even out. But, in an overtime game there is no time for the bounces to even out.
In a way we might as well flip a coin to get a winner and save some time and heart break. I would have been happy with a tie last night even if the overtime had gone our way. The way we played the last series in regulation and the way we tried to kick a 52 yard FG which had no chance was sad to me. It was a give up from a team that had fought hard all game and then gave up at the end. I promise you AJ throwing a Hail Mary on 4th down was more likely than Cade kicking a 52 yarder. Heck, let Trent run a draw play.
FanPosts are just that; posts created by the fans. They are in no way indicative of the opinions of SBN and the authors of Roll Bama Roll.
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Have to agree
with most of this. I’d rather see the NFL-style extra period with sudden death. At least then you’re still playing real football. I like the way you put it:
overtime is not even football it is a sport invented to prevent tie games.
"I reject your reality and substitute my own!"
-Adam Savage
I prefer the NFL style too but there are still two problems.
The coin toss winner is still a favorite and the injury situation is still present. Football as we know it does not need to be played more than 60 minutes. Fatigue increases the chance of injury.
If Auburn was in New Mexico and we never played them I would still hate them and their dumb coach and their cheating players.
I don't know
I like the chance to play a little extra in a very close game to see if anyone can edge out the other. I’d like just a 6ish minute extra period, no sudden death (that rewards luck too much, and gives absolutely no incentive to get a touchdown instead of a FG), if the teams are still tied at the end, the game ends in a tie, because I do like the chance of actually having a tie.
Proud member of the Fax Girl fan club.
If we were going to go that way, I'd prefer 10 minutes.
At 6 minutes, one team could keep the ball the entire time, especially if you only give them 1 time out. I prefer both teams to get the ball so that the coin toss is less significant.
God bless our Dark Lord.
I can see that
I like the argument that the coin-flip loser’s defense needs to step up, but I think sudden death doesn’t allow ANY room for error. I think it’s good to make the defense still have to get off the field if nothing else, but still give a chance to respond if the other team scores.
Proud member of the Fax Girl fan club.
by billycthulhu on Nov 8, 2011 11:02 AM CST up reply actions
I definitely prefer that to what we have,
but in addition to 50’s two problems I’ll add one more, and that is sudden death itself. Sudden death, also, isn’t football. You play to the end of the period. Just slap the 15 minutes on the clock, and let them play till time expires. If it’s still a tie, then let them keep the tie. (Of course this probably just means we need to play till regulation expires and be satisfied with that, but if we’re going to do an extra period of some sort, give them a full extra quarter to play).
"Let's go be champions, boys!" - Greg McElroy
(Formerly SugarBowl93)
by RememberTheRoseBowl on Nov 7, 2011 7:48 AM CST up reply actions
Or adopt something similar to hockey.
Add a 10 minute period, then if it’s still tied go to the current overtime system.
Dave Robertson is growing up to be the new Mariano Rivera. My two universes of fandom can finally unite!
by SoGladILeftTheACC on Nov 7, 2011 10:26 AM CST up reply actions
I'd like a 15 minute period and if a tie leave it a tie.
But still think playing an extra 15 minutes puts both teams at a disadvantage the next week.
If Auburn was in New Mexico and we never played them I would still hate them and their dumb coach and their cheating players.
I didn't see this when I did my last post
But it’s basically what I want. I think maybe 10 minutes (or even 6 or 7) would work, because I do think an extra 15 is a bit much. I like giving very close teams a chance to avoid a tie with some extra time, but I also like being able to end in a tie if they really are that evenly matched.
Proud member of the Fax Girl fan club.
It would have to be longer than 6-7 min.
At least in the SEC, there are a lot of teams that can make one drive last about that long, and I think both teams need a chance to score. That would necessitate at least a 9-10 minute period, but even in that situation, the coin flip could very easily place the advantage with one team or the other if a team that plays with the slow, drag-it-out pace wins the flip. A full extra quarter of play is really the only fair thing – it is the only way to ensure that both teams get a shot at having the ball for a reasonable amount of time to mount a 5-6 minute drive even if the other team runs a bunch of clock. As it stands, though, what several on here have pointed out is right…15 extra minutes is waaay too long to keep those guys out there.
"Let's go be champions, boys!" - Greg McElroy
(Formerly SugarBowl93)
by RememberTheRoseBowl on Nov 7, 2011 11:24 PM CST up reply actions
I would prefer the soccer model, up to a point:
An extra time period, not sudden death; then the luck of the coin toss is mitigated. Still tied after 10-15 more minutes? Let it be a draw, unless it’s a conference or national championship game. If it’s one of those, play as many extra periods as it takes.
I like the GA HS co-champions thing.
By the way, my soccer team just lost our tourney final in golden goal extra time. We had our chances, just couldn’t finish the 1st-place team off. But that’s just recreation. Truth still hurts.
But not anywhere near as bad as last night’s Bama game.
Hadn't read your comment
when I posted above, but I totally agree.
"Let's go be champions, boys!" - Greg McElroy
(Formerly SugarBowl93)
by RememberTheRoseBowl on Nov 7, 2011 7:49 AM CST up reply actions
Somebody has to win the game
The current NCAA OT rules are not very good. However, the NFL is not that good either in that a coin flip is not exactly “fair.” That being said, at least the NCAA system allows both teams an opportunity. It could be argued that they should move the yard line back from the 25, but I think the original design was to come to a reasonably quick conclusion. After all, most folks think it comes down to the kicker. That is not true. The entire offense has the chance to score a TD before it falls back on the kicker. In yesterday’s OT periods, our players were beaten.
I would disagree that somebody has to win
Football was played for well over 100 years with ties. Surprisingly even when ties occured life went on. Furthermore I do not feel the football played before the overtime rule was less than today’s football. In some ways I think it was more.
One of the most famous college games of all time was in 1946 when #2 Notre Dame and #1 Army tied 0-0. I know you guys think that would be a terrible game, but I would have loved to watch it live. That kind of game has been out lawed today,
If Auburn was in New Mexico and we never played them I would still hate them and their dumb coach and their cheating players.
Harvey Dent disagrees with you
on the coin flip.
"I reject your reality and substitute my own!"
-Adam Savage
The coin flip isn't the part that rewards luck
It’s that the team only has to get a couple first downs so they can kick a field goal because the other team won’t get a chance to respond and there’s no point in scoring a touchdown.
Proud member of the Fax Girl fan club.
Turning wine into whine
OT has nothing to do as to why we lost. College OT is fun, exciting, and entertaining. Had we come up on the right side of it, I promise that this sort of post never exists. We had our chances to prevent this sort of thing, and blew it. My guess, if you seriously look inside yourself 5026, you had no problem enjoying OT wins over Arkansas and LSU, regardless of these “ridiculous” rules.
by BamaThrasher on Nov 6, 2011 11:52 PM CST reply actions 2 recs
Well, something has to motivate someone to post.
But being satisfied when we win OT is not the same as saying that a person opposes it generally. I hate OT periods, and I hated it when we went into it against Arky a few years back, and I hated it Sat. night – before the end results of either game. Sure I’m glad when Bama wins in OT – what fan wouldn’t be? But that doesn’t mean I have ever agreed that we need them. I’m not surprised this post came after a loss in OT. I don’t guess I’d expect it to appear after a win in OT. That doesn’t change how some of us generally feel about the concept of OT in football, however.
"Let's go be champions, boys!" - Greg McElroy
(Formerly SugarBowl93)
by RememberTheRoseBowl on Nov 7, 2011 7:58 AM CST up reply actions
I was sitting there during that drive we started with 8-ish minutes on the clock going
“Please, God, let us score so we don’t have to go into overtime.” Overtime sucks. I hated it for Stanford and USC last week, and I hated it more for us Saturday.
Dave Robertson is growing up to be the new Mariano Rivera. My two universes of fandom can finally unite!
by SoGladILeftTheACC on Nov 7, 2011 10:28 AM CST up reply actions
Hey SoGladILeft, I was wondering if you could help a MDB fan out?
I always listen to the youtube recordings of the numbers the MDB performs. However, there are several that are not on the current CD (or any CD I can find), like Viva la Vida, Don’t Stop Believing, Carry On Wayward Son, etc. Do you have an inside track on those, uh… tracks, or know anyone I could email on this?
Paul W. Bryant,
Sir Alex Ferguson,
Truly the best of both footballing worlds.
by TiderUpNorth on Nov 7, 2011 11:09 AM CST up reply actions
I have a Greatest Hits CD sitting in my car.
I will look at it when I go to rehearsal and let you know if any of those are on there, but I don’t remember recording Viva la Vida or Don’t Stop Believing. I know the Carry On Wayward Son/Point of Know Return medley we used for a halftime show last year will be on there.
Dave Robertson is growing up to be the new Mariano Rivera. My two universes of fandom can finally unite!
by SoGladILeftTheACC on Nov 7, 2011 12:08 PM CST up reply actions
Awesomeness! You're the greatest!
I did recently purchase the CD with the MDB photographed at the Rose Bowl. There is another release out there?
Paul W. Bryant,
Sir Alex Ferguson,
Truly the best of both footballing worlds.
We (members) received a copy of the 2010 season CD late last month.
Not sure if it’s not general sale yet. If it is, it’ll be on the Supe Store website.
Dave Robertson is growing up to be the new Mariano Rivera. My two universes of fandom can finally unite!
by SoGladILeftTheACC on Nov 7, 2011 3:13 PM CST up reply actions
It's got Kansas on it, but not Viva la Vida or Don't Stop Believing.
Find me on Twitter (@CaseyAlyssa) and DM me your email and I can probably send you Kansas? I can try, anyway.
Dave Robertson is growing up to be the new Mariano Rivera. My two universes of fandom can finally unite!
by SoGladILeftTheACC on Nov 7, 2011 6:39 PM CST up reply actions
Fate would have it that I am the only person in the free world NOT on twitter or facebook.
But, if you like you can send it via email/magic at franksinatra@wi.rr.com
PS: Thanks a billion for trying and yes, I’m flying blind, as I have never downloaded a song in my life.
Paul W. Bryant,
Sir Alex Ferguson,
Truly the best of both footballing worlds.
by TiderUpNorth on Nov 8, 2011 12:34 PM CST up reply actions
Win or lose I do not like OT.
Never have, never will. I posted this because this past Sat when I saw us sit on the ball late it reminded me of how much I hate OT. AND….anyone who has guts and believes in his guys would not sit on the ball with 1 minute and 2 time outs. I think somebody needs to grow a pair and that goes for the guys on the LSU side too.
If Auburn was in New Mexico and we never played them I would still hate them and their dumb coach and their cheating players.
The fact is changing OT rules now, next year, or in 10 years
Would not change the results of last night’s game. LSU won, fair and square, no voodoo, just good defense getting us out of FG range in overtime.
That said, I don’t like the way college OR NFL overtime works, regardless of what happened last night. 5026’s best point is the fact that OT only faintly resembles the actual game of football. No clock, no need to get down the field, just look at what your opponent does and try to match or 1-up it. I DO think OT should exist in general, but I think it should resemble an actual period (though shortened) of football, as the game is actually played during regulation.
Proud member of the Fax Girl fan club.
Agree a great deal
I hate NCAA OT. Back in the 1990’s Mike Gottfried on ESPN complained that you play for field position for 60 minutes and then throw it away in NCAA OT. And this is from a run and shoot guy, whom I would not think be as concerned with field position as someone like Saban or Miles. Plus a 28-28 game can become a 56-49 game, completely.
I prefer an NFL style OT for conference championships and a playoff system culminating ln a true national championship.
by the thin red line on Nov 7, 2011 12:09 AM CST reply actions
I hate the bizarre scores you get in OT
It makes modern scores not comparable to pre-OT scores and warps stats.
I think it's fine.
You (we) are just butt hurt at the outcome of the game.
If Bama would’ve won, this post would not exist.
RBR's King of Hip-Hop...
Actually,
I ’ve hated the NCAA OT rule since Day 1 without letup. Of course, I’ll take a W whatever the rules are. And I ’ ll take a BCS Championship. But I very strongly prefer NFL style OT and playoff system.
However, I’ m not sure if we would have won in a 15-minute sudden death OT. What would we have done differently in the Fifth Quarter? The playcalling sucked, so unless Trent and/or someone on D would have gotten a big play, probably just more of the same results on offense. While some reporters have suggested that the NCAA OT seemed to favor the LSU kicker, I suppose he would be better at longer FG’s than Foster and Shelley. And Wing showed what he can do with field position. At least the short field of the current rules helps us with Trent and Shelley.
by the thin red line on Nov 7, 2011 2:58 AM CST up reply actions
I very strongly prefer the NCAA OT.
I think sudden death is BS. But I would prefer that we start at the 40 instead of the 25, so that you actually have to do something positive to score.
God bless our Dark Lord.
That was one of two Lou Holtz statements I agreed with on College Football Final.
The other was “I don’t know if LSU or Alabama is a better team. LSU’s kicker is better than Alabama’s kickers, but that’s all I know.”
Dave Robertson is growing up to be the new Mariano Rivera. My two universes of fandom can finally unite!
by SoGladILeftTheACC on Nov 7, 2011 10:29 AM CST up reply actions
I would prefer it be played just like an actual period of football
But I do agree that sudden death sucks. Just play til the end of the period and call it a win, lose, or draw at that point.
Proud member of the Fax Girl fan club.
If they did a coin toss
to decide the winner, and the players never even saw the field, you better believe I’d pull for Bama to win the toss. That doesn’t mean it’s a good system to use.
Yeah, I’m hurt that Bama lost, but long before this game I felt that having to have a winner (at least by these OT rules) sets up two unfair situations for teams. First, it causes situations where a lesser team valiantly holds their own against a better team till the buzzer, and then loses in OT – they should be given the dignity of a tie. And second, it misrepresents situations where two equal teams play one another to a tie in regulation – the winner in those OT situations does not reflect the more dominant team, because sometimes there’s not one.
I doubt this post exists if Bama won, and I don’t doubt it exists because of the hurt of the loss, but whatever the motivation behind the post, situations like this give us the chance to evaluate what we think of these things in general, and I appreciate 50 bringing it up.
"Let's go be champions, boys!" - Greg McElroy
(Formerly SugarBowl93)
by RememberTheRoseBowl on Nov 7, 2011 8:07 AM CST up reply actions
You know, I have to agree with you. My ONLY reason for disliking CFB OT, is
quite simply that Alabama are not a traditional red-zone-TD-machine. Thusly, CFB OT doesn’t benefit us in the least. Besides, McIlwain couldn’t call a decent game consistently during regulation. What makes any of us think he would suddenly call a savvy OT plan?
Paul W. Bryant,
Sir Alex Ferguson,
Truly the best of both footballing worlds.
by TiderUpNorth on Nov 7, 2011 11:01 AM CST up reply actions
Of course you know
that since LSU doesn’t have a very good blog they are over here reading this as I write, and they are saying" you wouldn’t be writing this post if Alabama would have won". And another thing I can’t believe that I haven’t read any more on here about that player with a dumbass nickname “Honeybadger” almost killing Dre Kirkpatrick with what the dumbass referees called a hold. I know it wouldn’t have made a difference in the game but that SOB should have been thrown out of the game.
Those of you...
…that have been here a while know I’m a soccer fan as well. I also spend a decent amount of time on some soccer message boards and one guy on that board from Europe (he didn’t identify what country) had what I thought was an accurate assessment of OT in football. He said “It was like deciding your championship by penalty kicks.” Post-overtime penalty kicks are the most loathed way to decide a game and lining up on the 25 with no clock running is pretty much the same thing. If there’s going to be overtime, it should be like the sport itself. Like 5026, I’ve been adamantly opposed to overtime for years, it has nothing to do with this game. You can search it within the site and find us railing against it without an Alabama game framing the discussion.
Getting rid of the "Golden Goal" ushered in the possibility of an dirty group of unimaginative low-lifes like Italy waiting OT out for the penalty kick formalities.
Ridiculous and a perfect reason why football has been made more boring than ever. By ending the “Golden Goal” sudden death nature of football tounaments, they actually rewarded stoneage footballing and guaranteed a sleepy 30 minutes of extra time. Sounds like a great idea, huh?
Paul W. Bryant,
Sir Alex Ferguson,
Truly the best of both footballing worlds.
by TiderUpNorth on Nov 7, 2011 10:58 AM CST up reply actions
i like the fact that we dont have ties in the NCAA...
I would change it giving each team a possession. Keep the rules about a team having to win the same, going for two, etc but just make teams kick it off and drive the length of the field. Thats a much better reflection of a teams ability to win than just getting the ball on the 25.
Follow on twitter @thelyell
I played soccer in college in the 70's
and we had a fair amount of ties. I’m glad we never lined up for the penalty kick circus.
I know it sounds wierd but why do we think ties are evil or something?
If Auburn was in New Mexico and we never played them I would still hate them and their dumb coach and their cheating players.
How far can you kick the ball, and do you have any eligibility left?!!!
God bless our Dark Lord.
by CarrotTop4 on Nov 8, 2011 8:09 AM CST up reply actions 2 recs
Not very far anymore.
My soccer coach actually use to make us practice kicking field goals with a soccer ball from 40 yards. I thought that was a dumb drill as the ball was sitting still and in a game that hardly ever happens. Nevertheless most of the guys I played with in college could easily nail one from 40-50 yards. However, to me it is not the same as kicking a football. Because it is round a soccer ball is much easier to control and your tragectory is much lower.
If Auburn was in New Mexico and we never played them I would still hate them and their dumb coach and their cheating players.
If we’re going to compare sports
Here in Japan baseball games can end in ties after 12 innings. I still cannot get used to it if only because of custom and formal principle, no practical arguments on my behalf here. Apparently the Japanese rule exists for practical reasons, though. The trains don’t run 24 hours.
What irks me here is that the ties do not factor in winning percentage, or in the case of my Hanshin Tigers, losing percentage, nor factor in the games behind record. If a playoff game ends in a tie after 15 innings ends in a tie, the game must be replayed.
I still can remember Tom Selleck’s shock in atie Mr. Baseball in his first baseball game ending in a tie.
by the thin red line on Nov 7, 2011 2:42 PM CST reply actions
Prefer the NFL version to college version
assuming one tweak: If the team that wins the toss scores on their first possession, the other team gets a chance to tie it. But the moment someone is stopped on a drive, any score ends it, per normal sudden death rules.
That said, what I would really prefer it to simply take the kicking game out of it entirely. Let the team that wins the toss start on the 40 or whatever around there makes sense, or decline and let the other team start there. (Or if we absolutely must, one kickoff to launch the overtime period.) Then no punts, no field goals, no extra points. That kind of reverse the effect that 5026 deplores. Instead of racheting things down, suddenly they are racheted up. Now, there are no play it safe options.
For a really hardcore version, instead of an overtime period, apply the “no kickers” rule from the current field position, but reset to a 1st down. This makes the cat and mouse game for position before time runs out very critical. Of course, the one big flaw in a system like that, is that if it were applied to a game like LSU/Bama, and the ball happened to start at midfield, they might still be playing.
In that middle paragraph
prefer “is”. And also, the start would be own 40, not opponents.
by Steven Mitchell on Nov 7, 2011 5:08 PM CST up reply actions
I don't like any OT for football unless you have a playoff system where
someone must win to advance. But of all the formats, I dislike college the most.
I’ve even seen a HS game with the “penatration rule.” That OT game was too confusing for the fans. However, at least the penatration felt like football was being played.
I’d go for 1 extra 15 minute qt. and then a tie EXCEPT that wears down the players too much and exposes them to injury.
If Auburn was in New Mexico and we never played them I would still hate them and their dumb coach and their cheating players.
Start on your own 30 yard line.
No punts, one possession each. You either score, turn it over, or give the ball up on downs. If you score, the other team has to match what you did to keep the game going or best you to win it. If you give the ball up on downs then the other team has to start on their own 30 and advance the ball past where you did to win. In the case of a turnover, the other team has to advance it past where the fumble was recovered or where the INT was returned to. If a turnover happens behind the 30 yard line then the game is over (which makes sense, since the defense getting a TO that deep in enemy territory usually results in points. I said usually.) Is it the best plan? No. But it does incorporate defense a bit more.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
or where the INT was returned to.
So then you wouldn’t ever return an INT? Or are you saying the inverse? If you intercept and return to your own 40, then you have to drive (from your 30) to the opponent’s 40?
The whole thing seems even more convoluted than our current system.
God bless our Dark Lord.
What?
It’s just like returning an interception like usual, right? I don’t get what’s convoluted about it.
Proud member of the Fax Girl fan club.
by billycthulhu on Nov 9, 2011 11:32 AM CST up reply actions
You'd have to drive 70 yards usually in this system as I understand it
So if intercepting gives you worse field position than you would start out with after a score, you’re better off getting the worse field position because they are deep in your territory at that point and you’re preventing the score. The only thing I’d wonder about is a turnover on downs. I would think it would have to reset field position at the 30.
Proud member of the Fax Girl fan club.
by billycthulhu on Nov 9, 2011 11:35 AM CST up reply actions
It always resets at the 30.
After a score, turnover, or TOD. wherever the offense gave the ball up is where the other team has to get to.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
If the intercepting team returns it to the other team's 40
then their offense would only need 10 yards to win the game. If they return it past the other team’s 30, game over.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
OK, that's what I thought, but that's not actually what you said.
You’re not saying they have to drive it to “where the INT was returned to”. It’s not literally the same spot; it’s the opposite side of the field.
God bless our Dark Lord.
No, it is the same spot.
They are going to start their possession on their 30 yard line going the same direction the other team did, just like they do now to neutralize any wind/crowd advantages. If they return it to the opponent’s 40, a marker would be placed there that the intercepting team would have to pass. The f’d up thing about penetration ball is that the second team could intercept the ball 20 yards downfield (with no return) and lose because their offense only gained 15 on their possession.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
OK, well I guess it's the definition of "start on your OWN 30" that threw me off.
God bless our Dark Lord.
Yeah, you have to start on the same end for fairness.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
This is kinda like the penetration overtime
I’ve seen high schools in Ga. play. At least it is real football. The team going second does have an advantage of knowing what they need to do.
If Auburn was in New Mexico and we never played them I would still hate them and their dumb coach and their cheating players.
It only seems like a slight advantage to me
It’s one thing to know you need a touchdown, but it’s another to actually get it. It probably would change the 4th down play, though.
Proud member of the Fax Girl fan club.
by billycthulhu on Nov 9, 2011 11:31 AM CST up reply actions
I was thinkng more on the penetration angle.
If team one goes only to the 50 yard line then team two knows they only have to go to the opponets 49. If they had a first down, on say their own 48, they would run it 4 times to get to the 49. In real football at your own 48 you would not be trying to just get 3 yards.
If Auburn was in New Mexico and we never played them I would still hate them and their dumb coach and their cheating players.
Okay, I think I get it now
I didn’t really know how penetration (heh) works. I’m not sure I like that system.
Proud member of the Fax Girl fan club.
Me either
Well, I DO understand penetration, just not what this OT scenario is talking about. How do you get points for field position? Seems kinda dumb to me and removes the foundation of scoring in the sport.
Put 15 on the clock. You have a 5th quarter, so go to it. If it’s still a tie, then it’s a tie.
Attempting to remove humor from posts since August 30, 2011

"High standards come from passion within...." --Coach Nick Saban
by NiceLittleSaturday on Nov 10, 2011 9:25 AM CST up reply actions
Which ones?
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
What?
So now all sexual innuendos are banned? O, RBR, where art thou?
"High standards come from passion within...." --Coach Nick Saban
by NiceLittleSaturday on Nov 11, 2011 8:36 AM CST up reply actions
The problem
I have with this is that it rewards a nonscoring defense, while penalizing the defense for giving up yards, not points.
by the thin red line on Nov 10, 2011 11:14 PM CST up reply actions
Or you could say
that it penalizes an offense that couldn’t get as far as the other team’s offense did.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
The problem
I have with this is that it rewards a nonscoring defense, while penalizing the defense for giving up yards, not points.
by the thin red line on Nov 10, 2011 11:14 PM CST up reply actions
My first double post
That was supposed to be a reply. Time for a new smartphone.
by the thin red line on Nov 10, 2011 11:20 PM CST reply actions
Of course, there is one other way.
You could just institute tiebreakers like they use to determine division champions and whatnot. If the score ends in a tie at the end of four quarters, the team with the most total yards wins. Only problem there is that you would often have one team playing for a tie at the end while the other team desperately needs a score.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
you would often have one team playing for a tie at the end while the other team desperately needs a score.
Not necessarily endorsing this idea, but that scenario is not significantly different from what already happens at the end of most non-tied games. One team is playing to kill the clock and the other is desperately trying to score.
God bless our Dark Lord.
Playing for a tie just seems wrong though.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
And that's the problem with it.
It just goes against everything you know about football.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
Of course
I should add that the current OT system and any other ideas I’ve seen floated also bastardize the game as we know it in some way.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
Before this thread disappears I just want to
reiterate that (1) I have flet this way about overtime since it began, (2) Even if Bama had won the overtime I would still feel this way, (3) Some games are actually suited for ties. Football did real well for 100 + years with ties a part of the game and I still do not see why there needed to be a change unless we are playing an elimination game.
Let me draw one analogy. To me of all the team athletic games football most closely resembles chess. You make a move and your opponent counters that move, etc. For some strange reason no one seems to have a problem with a chess match ending in a draw. Why do we NOW feel football games must every single time have a winner and loser? It is not logical.
If Auburn was in New Mexico and we never played them I would still hate them and their dumb coach and their cheating players.
Because nobody watches chess?
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
Man, I would...
…that would be my favorite channel….
"High standards come from passion within...." --Coach Nick Saban
by NiceLittleSaturday on Nov 11, 2011 6:51 PM CST up reply actions
That would be some slow TV.
'There are two pains in life. There is the pain of discipline and the pain of disappointment. If you can handle the pain of discipline, then you'll never have to deal with the pain of disappointment,'- Nick Saban
In Japan
We have a cable channel devoted only to shogi and go. Now, that’s slow.
by the thin red line on Nov 12, 2011 12:57 AM CST up reply actions
Dude, I am 100% with you
The second we want to OT I turned to my friend and said “I HATE college overtime.” (Of course, I already knew we were at a disadvantage due to field-goal kicking, but I digress. . . .)
Anyway, just like you, I have been hatin’ on OT ever since it came around. In particular, as a stat freak, those ridiculous 64-56 scores just stick in my craw. The “it’s not football” argument gets me, too.
Anywho—even though I had already come up with most of your arguments on my own, you gifted me with a couple of new ones, particularly the elimination of the game-ending 2-pointer. I hadn’t thought of that, but you’re right, that was the most dramatic situation in football and they legislated that sucker right ouf of existence.. So I thank you for the post.
Oh, and let me add
Part of my sick feeling when we went to OT was because I knew the odds were against us. But the other part was because I knew that even if we won it would not be as good as a real one, it would be a crap-o OT win under non-football circumstances.
I agree.
I ’ m a stat freak, too.
First OT I saw was when 1996 Georgia played Auburn to what would have been a 28-28 final score. UGA won 56-49. In 2003 Bama and Tennessee played to a 20-20 tie. Vols won 51-43. The DC’s, Joe Kines (twice), Bill Oliver, and John Chavis, none of whom are chumps, must dread these statistical farces.
Stats aside, how does a DC deal with the present system? To have his charges backed up in regulation is bad enough, but repeatedly after 60 minutes of play?
by the thin red line on Nov 11, 2011 7:46 PM CST up reply actions
By the way...Horay to TCU for going for 2.
Their coach rightly stated that the odds were better to go for 2 in regulation than go to overtime. However, with 1 minute left it almost back fired.
If Auburn was in New Mexico and we never played them I would still hate them and their dumb coach and their cheating players.

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